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> The Future Of Wi Fi In Campgrounds
Bearcat
post Mar 13 2013, 04:07 PM
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I know that this issue was brought up in another thread about charging for wi-fi, but, this is a different issue. I called a campground to inquire about space,price, and of course wi-fi.

When I got to the last question about wi-fi, the answer caught me off guard.

Me: Do you have wi-fi?

CG: Yes, for now.

Me: umm, what do you mean? I was thinking that they can't pay their bills or ________.

CG: We've been having problems with illegal downloads of music and sometimes movies. We might have to cancel or restrict sites.

Me: Oh, I got it.


Ok , so why am I posting this thread. I really would hate to see campgrounds start cancelling wi-fi because of this unspoken (hush hush) problem.


Some people might reply and say something like, I don't think the CG will want to lose customers. Well that might be true, but, they are business owners that don't want problems either.



This is only a FYI thread ( nothing more!!)


We know that this issue will continue for many years, I'm only saying that if people want to do this, then they should at least protect the park.

What do I mean? seeing that this is an open forum, I don't think I should give out the program (solution). Unless I'm requested to do so. ( or maybe by PM)

How do I know about this? My son was doing this at his mothers house, she got a {not so nice threat letter} from the internet service. I always wondered how he got 1,900 songs on his Ipod with no job or credit card. lol,lol He lied at first and said he got them from his friend down the street. Lol, well your friend has no job either.

I researched this issue for about 2 days, and I found out what he did wrong. He was not protecting his IP address while downloading. Hint!

I know this is a sensitive post, but, it's happening every day in every CG.

Some parents might ask- Are their warning signs I should look out for? Yes, but let's wait and see if this post goes anywhere.
















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joez
post Mar 22 2013, 04:39 PM
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For those interested, this article from RV Business describes issues with internet at a Texas RV Park that, according to the article, "parks have bought a ‘commercial’ service for their parks thinking that covers them regarding Wi-Fi in their parks. But the fine print says they cannot distribute Internet in their parks. Almost every park in the USA has or will have this problem.”

Be interesting to see how this plays outl

RV Park internet issues
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docj
post Mar 22 2013, 07:36 PM
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QUOTE(joez @ Mar 22 2013, 05:39 PM) *

For those interested, this article from RV Business describes issues with internet at a Texas RV Park that, according to the article, "parks have bought a ‘commercial’ service for their parks thinking that covers them regarding Wi-Fi in their parks. But the fine print says they cannot distribute Internet in their parks. Almost every park in the USA has or will have this problem.”

Be interesting to see how this plays outl

RV Park internet issues



Re-reading the article a couple of times, I think there are two sorts of things they are after, one is CG owners who pay for residential wifi accounts and then share them at the CG. The other is copyright violations resulting from illegal downloading by customers at the CG.

As for the first issue, I think it's likely that overall wifi performance at CG's would be significantly improved if CG owners paid for commercial accounts rather than trying to bootleg on residential ones. Although it would result in higher costs that would get passed along to customers, it might reduce or end some of the complaints people have about CG wifi.

With respect to copyright infringement by illegal downloads, it will force CG owners to invest in the necessary hardware/software to prevent people from accessing known piracy sites. This also will probably improve everyone else's wifi experience because the folks doing downloads are probably extremely heavy users who slow down the system for everyone else.


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Bearcat
post Mar 23 2013, 03:06 PM
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QUOTE(docj @ Mar 22 2013, 08:36 PM) *

Re-reading the article a couple of times, I think there are two sorts of things they are after, one is CG owners who pay for residential wifi accounts and then share them at the CG. The other is copyright violations resulting from illegal downloading by customers at the CG.

As for the first issue, I think it's likely that overall wifi performance at CG's would be significantly improved if CG owners paid for commercial accounts rather than trying to bootleg on residential ones. Although it would result in higher costs that would get passed along to customers, it might reduce or end some of the complaints people have about CG wifi.

With respect to copyright infringement by illegal downloads, it will force CG owners to invest in the necessary hardware/software to prevent people from accessing known piracy sites. This also will probably improve everyone else's wifi experience because the folks doing downloads are probably extremely heavy users who slow down the system for everyone else.





I"ll have to research some more on the WI-FI downloading, but, so far all I can find is this.
If you got 20 people at a CG, and your signal is about 4 bars

I dont think it matters because you can only use what ya got

Ex: 5 people downloading
5 people streaming movies
5 people checking email, banking, social sites
3 kids playing Online Playstation
2 people writing parks reviews

So it going to slow down. Unless it 3 AM


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docj
post Mar 23 2013, 07:40 PM
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QUOTE(RVbailman @ Mar 23 2013, 04:06 PM) *

I"ll have to research some more on the WI-FI downloading, but, so far all I can find is this.
If you got 20 people at a CG, and your signal is about 4 bars

I dont think it matters because you can only use what ya got

Ex: 5 people downloading
5 people streaming movies
5 people checking email, banking, social sites
3 kids playing Online Playstation
2 people writing parks reviews

So it going to slow down. Unless it 3 AM


Even though you can only use the bandwidth you have, from the ISP's perspective a commercial customer is going to have far greater average bandwidth usage on a 27/7 basis than will a residential customer. Therefore, when the ISP is planning how many customers it can support on a particular internet pipe, if those customers purchase residential service but then use it commercially, it is quite possible that the ISP's entire network will be overloaded and everyone will suffer. Remember that the issue of sharing a campground wifi is no different in concept than everyone in a community sharing a cable company's internet connection. It has to be sized appropriately for the anticipated load.


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kcmoedoe
post Mar 24 2013, 12:26 PM
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QUOTE(docj @ Mar 23 2013, 08:40 PM) *

Even though you can only use the bandwidth you have, from the ISP's perspective a commercial customer is going to have far greater average bandwidth usage on a 27/7 basis than will a residential customer. Therefore, when the ISP is planning how many customers it can support on a particular internet pipe, if those customers purchase residential service but then use it commercially, it is quite possible that the ISP's entire network will be overloaded and everyone will suffer. Remember that the issue of sharing a campground wifi is no different in concept than everyone in a community sharing a cable company's internet connection. It has to be sized appropriately for the anticipated load.

Also, don't forget that the number of bars on the device is how well your device is receiving the transmission from the wifi source. It has nothing to do with how well the wifi device is receiving your transmission. Wifi is a two way radio communication. It is a well establishec fact that device makers have significantly reduced the transmitting power of the radio inside the devices in order to increase battery life. For a wifi connection to work, the wifi souce has to receive the data and requests that are sent from your device before it can send the webpage to you. Many times it becomes a "can you hear me now"moment where your device can hear the wifi source clearly since they are generally powered to the maximum amount allowed by the FCC, but the wifi source cannot hear your computer's transmissions because it is lower powered, so nothing happens. Computer wifi systems are designed to continually repeat that transmission until it is answered, hence why that little circle keeps rotating until something finally pops up. It may not be a problem at all with the wifi system or bandwidth, it may just be your device isn't transmitting with enough power to be heard by the wifi system. This can be tested by moving closer to the wifi source. If you were seeing 4 or 5 bars when the system wasn't working before and you have moved closer and suddenly your system starts working much better, the problem is your devices radio transmitter, not the lack of bandwidth from the wifi source
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docj
post Mar 24 2013, 08:49 PM
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QUOTE(kcmoedoe @ Mar 24 2013, 01:26 PM) *

Many times it becomes a "can you hear me now"moment where your device can hear the wifi source clearly since they are generally powered to the maximum amount allowed by the FCC, but the wifi source cannot hear your computer's transmissions because it is lower powered, so nothing happens.


This is exactly why many "serious RVers" own wifi amplifiers with external antennas such as those made by WiFiRanger and Cradlepoint. With output power in excess of 600 mW the WiFiRanger Mobile system can connect to virtually any campground access point you are likely to encounter.


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Posts in this topic
RVbailman   The Future Of Wi Fi In Campgrounds   Mar 13 2013, 04:07 PM
DXSMac   Um..... you can also "rip" those songs d...   Mar 14 2013, 01:58 PM
RVbailman   Yes your correct- ripping is legal and very common...   Mar 14 2013, 03:47 PM
joez   What he did wrong was the illegal activity (thef...   Mar 15 2013, 09:01 AM
Lindsay Richards   As far as people watching movies on the campground...   Mar 15 2013, 07:25 PM
pianotuna   Hi, Wifi in campgrounds is going to be hard press...   Mar 15 2013, 08:44 PM
docj   Wifi in campgrounds is going to be hard pressed. ...   Mar 16 2013, 11:35 AM
Lindsay Richards   Not sure if this is true for commercial bandwidth,...   Mar 16 2013, 08:23 AM
joez   For those interested, this article from RV Busines...   Mar 22 2013, 04:39 PM
docj   For those interested, this article from RV Busine...   Mar 22 2013, 07:36 PM
kcmoedoe   Re-reading the article a couple of times, I think...   Mar 23 2013, 03:00 PM
RVbailman   Re-reading the article a couple of times, I think...   Mar 23 2013, 03:06 PM
docj   I"ll have to research some more on the WI-FI...   Mar 23 2013, 07:40 PM
kcmoedoe   Even though you can only use the bandwidth you ha...   Mar 24 2013, 12:26 PM
docj   Many times it becomes a "can you hear me now...   Mar 24 2013, 08:49 PM
camping1158   I was talking to a campground owner and I think ca...   Apr 5 2013, 09:42 PM
JDOLLEN   I was talking to a campground owner and I think c...   Apr 6 2013, 09:50 AM
docj   Further, there are just too many other businesse...   Apr 6 2013, 11:01 AM
Dutch_12078   I can envision future scenarios in which CG owner...   Apr 6 2013, 03:26 PM
WrongWayRandall   I think the scenario you are painting is a bit of...   May 30 2013, 01:43 PM


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